[pclayton]

Scoring: IMP

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Short Matches, IMPS.

You open 1♣, 1♦ on your left, negative double by pard showing both majors. 1N on your right.

Your call?

Footnotes:

1) 1♣ - 1 major - 3♦ is a mini-splinter.

2) 1♣ - 1 major - 4♣ is a Walsh jump.

The actual auction is undiscussed in your partnership.

[JohnnyH7]

3H. Forcing to game seems like too much.

[mike777]

3clubs on the theory that 7-1 fits play better than 4-4 fits.

[toothbrush]

i don't need much from partner to make 4♥. If he has the wrong cards, i believe opps are able to make something. I bid what I want to play and that's 4♥

[jdonn]

I'll go all the way to 4D. 1NT suggests the club and heart finesses will be onside (and any spade finesse for that matter), and I hope to discourage a diamond lead since I don't want my hand tapped right away if I can help it. I prefer this bid to 4C, although that should retain its normal meaning here.

[jdonn]

One more thing I forgot to mention. The one bid I really really dislike is 3H. Partner hasn't got the slightest clue what he needs for game. Isn't xxxx Kxxxx xx xx game on this hand?

[JohnnyH7]

jdonn, on Mar 22 2006, 05:32 PM, said:

One more thing I forgot to mention. The one bid I really really dislike is 3H. Partner hasn't got the slightest clue what he needs for game. Isn't xxxx Kxxxx xx xx game on this hand?

This hand is not very consistent with the auction and is very contrived. Partner happens to have 5 hearts for his negative X, the opponents have 11 diamonds and 25 HCP and bid 1N. Partner will know that trump values are good for game, a club card is useful, and spade honors are likely better than diamond honors. He will know that a fifth trump is very good, and more honors are better. I think he has a generally good idea of what a good hand is.

Why is 4D a splinter for hearts? If it is a splinter for either major, how can partner accurately evaluate if his hand is slam suitable? How can he take over and bid keycard?

Sure you can contrive some great minimums for partner that fit well and make game when he would pass. Just remember many of these hands make game for the opponents as well, and partner rates to have both diamond length (meaning club shortness) and diamond honors (meaning wastage). When you get tapped at trick one and are facing a stiff club, things are not going to go that well if you don't have sufficient firepower.

[JohnnyH7]

jdonn, on Mar 22 2006, 05:30 PM, said:

1NT suggests the club and heart finesses will be onside (and any spade finesse for that matter)

Why is the 1N bidder likely to have heart honors but not spade honors when partner has shown both majors? Did you think partner bid 1H?

[luis]

2♥, this is not over.... yet!

[jdonn]

JohnnyH7, on Mar 22 2006, 06:08 PM, said:

jdonn, on Mar 22 2006, 05:32 PM, said:

One more thing I forgot to mention. The one bid I really really dislike is 3H. Partner hasn't got the slightest clue what he needs for game. Isn't xxxx Kxxxx xx xx game on this hand?

This hand is not very consistent with the auction and is very contrived. Partner happens to have 5 hearts for his negative X, the opponents have 11 diamonds and 25 HCP and bid 1N. Partner will know that trump values are good for game, a club card is useful, and spade honors are likely better than diamond honors. He will know that a fifth trump is very good, and more honors are better. I think he has a generally good idea of what a good hand is.

Why is 4D a splinter for hearts? If it is a splinter for either major, how can partner accurately evaluate if his hand is slam suitable? How can he take over and bid keycard?

Sure you can contrive some great minimums for partner that fit well and make game when he would pass. Just remember many of these hands make game for the opponents as well, and partner rates to have both diamond length (meaning club shortness) and diamond honors (meaning wastage). When you get tapped at trick one and are facing a stiff club, things are not going to go that well if you don't have sufficient firepower.

Sorry I have to confess I thought partner bid 1H, not double, which is why some of my comments made little sense. I still don't like 3H on hands with this much shape since partner's action is a total guess. I think you simply have to take your chances and bid game on such shapely hands.

[joshs]

pclayton, on Mar 22 2006, 05:16 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

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Short Matches, IMPS.

You open 1♣, 1♦ on your left, negative double by pard showing both majors. 1N on your right.

Your call?

Footnotes:

1) 1♣ - 1 major - 3♦ is a mini-splinter.

2) 1♣ - 1 major - 4♣ is a Walsh jump.

The actual auction is undiscussed in your partnership.

A tactical 2C. The auction isn't going to die there.

[hrothgar]

jdonn, on Mar 23 2006, 02:43 AM, said:

I think you simply have to take your chances and bid game on such shapely hands.

I would have opened 5♣

Burgess's rule strikes again

[mike777]

hrothgar, on Mar 22 2006, 06:48 PM, said:

jdonn, on Mar 23 2006, 02:43 AM, said:

I think you simply have to take your chances and bid game on such shapely hands.

I would have opened 5♣

Burgess's rule strikes again

Was waiting for this post from Richard, did not want to steal his thunder . Agree 5Clubs.

[luke warm]

i'd bid 4♦

[cherdano]

I admit it would not occur to me to stay out of game with this hand. I bid 3♦ followed by 4♥ over any rebid by partner. Hopefully partner will work out that 3♦ was showing shortness on the way to 4♥.

(I think 4♣ should just show clubs here, as partner cannot know which major I would be raising.)

Arend

[Kalvan14]

4♥. I am strongly convinced I can play game in 4♥; I am equally convinced that a slam is out of the question (don't like looking for miracle hands).

Btw, all red I don't think that oppos are playing funny games

[adhoc3]

I think 3D is straight forward, showing value increase(nice fit found) and short. Cant imagine pard won't copy that after 3D-...-4H. But 4C/D could be confused with other means, such as, both majors fit, super strong hand, etc.

[Free]

Seems like a difficult problem, since all votes are scattered! And Luis claims to bid 2♥ but it doesn't appear in the votes

I blast to 4♥. We all want to play there, invites are quite useless since partner will almost always accept, and we want to put pressure for opps to bid again. Note that this doesn't show a maximum hand, otherwise start with Dbl or 2♦ or so.
If my bidding got me too high, I'll depend on my declarer play to catch up if possible...

[hatchett]

3♦ for me. It wouldn't surprise me if RHO is having a little joke with some diamonds. I make a straightforward call that should leave partner well placed to judge. For me the hand is a bit light in cards for a 4♦ void splinter although if this hand falls within expected parameters in your partnership that would be my choice.

[pclayton]

This was my hand. I bid 3♦ at the table. Double by lefty, 3N by pard, 4♥ by me.

I bought: ♠Txxx, ♥KQxx, ♦Axxxx, ♣void. ♦lead made 10 tricks pretty routine. I think we picked up a game swing; our wild teammates sacced in 4♠ (after bidding and raising ♦'s) and they took the push to 5♥.

Chris Larsen and Ross Grabel are my IMP league teammates and I gave them the hand independently.

Ross had real strong reservations about any level of hearts, but felt 3♥ was about right. He has real concerns about the closed hand getting tapped right away and completely killing the ♣ suit. Note that on a spade lead, spade and a trump shift, this hand becomes basically unmanageable, in spite of the strong trump in both hands. He thought of many layouts where ♣'s plays a lot better than ♥'s.

Chris had some unprintable words about 3♦; how is pard supposed to figure out what our trump suit is? It seemed to me that 3 (or 4♥) is sort of 'foisted' on pard and we can clarify. I guess I would characterize 3♦ as imaginative; although pard didn't figure it out at the time.

Neither Chris nor Ross thought that the bidding was going to cease anytime soon, so maybe an educated underbid like 2♥ will throw the defense off.

4♣ has the same 'setting trump' issues; although pard can punt with 4♦ easily enough. I think that 4♣ also screams to the defenders to start tapping the closed hand to kill the clubs. In spite of our nice club suit and the K♣ being in the slot, slam has real long odds with our vulnerable opponents in the auction. This gives credence to non-descriptive shots like 3♥ and 4♥.

Interesting hand. Thanks all.