[cherdano]

Scoring: IMP

Pass-Pass-5♦-X
Pass-?

---

[han]

I'm passing, 5S second choice.

No idea if it is right, so I'm looking forward to the other comments.

[pclayton]

Brutal!

I'm pulling to 5♠ since I think I have the shape for the call. We also appear to have something of a double fit. I'm glad I'm a passed hand; hopefully pard will realize I don't have 6 or more spades since I didn't open a weak 2 (not a completely reliable inference )

Passing is possible, but I'm not ready to take +100 / +300 when I think +650 OR more is available.

Its the big game of +1430 that I'm really after by pulling.

At least thats what I'll tell myself as I enter -100 on my scoresheet.

[inquiry]

5♠

Partner made a takeout double I have five card suit.. He didn't promise the worlds fair, and I have just about average.

[P_Marlowe]

5S, they got you.
Being Red vs. Green, I try to bid game
hoping to make it.
Forcing to the 6 leve may kill partner,
who was under pressure to find a bid.

I may trade +300 against -100, but then I
may get +650.

Marlowe

[JohnnyH7]

Pass. Experience dictates taking the cash when your game is not sure. Things will split poorly, you possibly have only an 8 card fit in spades (on a really bad day a 7 card fit), you have no aces, etc. I'm willing to take 300 or 500 to avoid going -50.

[luis]

5♠ when they open 5♦ they are usually prepared to play 5♦x

[mike777]

5s

Using FTL and assuming p is 4414 with 12-14 whcp we should make 11 tricks.
13-2+0=11.
If partner is 4405 with 12-14 whcp or is 4414 with 15+ whcp we should have a play for 12 tricks.
If partner makes an auto assumption of 7 whcp in our hand hopefully they will be able to move on with the better hand. I guess partner will assume any finesses through my hand will work but through hers will fail?

[toothbrush]

I also prefer an almost certain +650.
I don't think 5♦ will go down 4, I rather believe we miss a good slam.

[luke warm]

oh what the hell, put me down for 6♦

[Kalvan14]

5♠, I think there is no doubt. Which - IMO - should be forward going. with a weak hand I should pass 5♦X

[awm]

If double was takeout, it seems normal to bid 5♠. But is double takeout? I think standard is that it's just "values" and should only be removed with shape. If partner has a doubleton diamond, five spades is quite likely to be a disaster. In any case, suits are not breaking well on this hand, and there's no reason partner has to have four spades. I'll pass and take the plus score.

[cherdano]

For the record, almost the same situation was discussed in the most recent MSC:

After 5♣-X at IMPs all white, the majority would take out with
AKxxxx xx xxx xx but leave in with AKxxx xx xxxx xx.

I think the actual hand is in between.

Arend

[mikeh]

I will give them the 4 imps or so that they get for my pass, if we can go 650 against their 500: and it is very difficult to construct hands on which they have more than 8 winners and we have 11. I will pay to a 9 or 10 card ♦ suit, and cater more to AKJxxxxx: a holding that would be more than we need for a white v red 5♦ opening. I would expect that dummy has no entry... and if it does, then we probably are in trouble if I bid. So I have some chance of 800 and little chance of less than 500. So passing gives up little when it is slightly wrong, and may win a little. Of course, passing gives up on slam, but that may be unbiddable anyway and it avoids a disastrous -100 either in 5♠ or if partner overbids (which he almost certainly won't).

[Chamaco]

A question to the experts here:
can you provide some concrete examples of the hands that pard might have for his double ?

E.g. what is the minimum high card content requirement for his double, assuming he has shortness in the opened suit ?

This criterion would of course also impact some hands that, despite the ideal shape, would be too weak too double because the hcp content does not match the abovementioned criterion.

No state of the match issue, let's just consider it's just a normal board in a normal match.

[helene_t]

If p has the typical 4414 there're 18 total trumps. ♦Q may be a negative correction factor but let's allow for 19 total tricks due to LHO's great length. So it's quite likely that neither 5♦ nor 5♠ will make, and "pass" will get me 500 vs 650 which I'm not woried about at IMPs.

The 5-level belongs to the opponents.

Btw, did opps play Namyats in 3rd seat? In that case, 5♦ in this position is just a text-book 3♦-opening. Nothing to be scared about.

[Free]

helene_t, on Mar 23 2006, 09:50 AM, said:

If p has the typical 4414 there're 18 total trumps. ♦Q may be a negative correction factor but let's allow for 19 total tricks due to LHO's great length. So it's quite likely that neither 5♦ nor 5♠ will make, and "pass" will get me 500 vs 650 which I'm not woried about at IMPs.

The 5-level belongs to the opponents.

Btw, did opps play Namyats in 3rd seat? In that case, 5♦ in this position is just a text-book 3♦-opening. Nothing to be scared about.

You also need to make a slight adjustments in your total tricks, since you have ♦Qxx which are lost in defense tnx to the Dbl.

Put me down for 5♠, with 6♦ as close second...

[Chamaco]

Free, on Mar 23 2006, 10:59 AM, said:

You also need to make a slight adjustments in your total tricks, since you have ♦Qxx which are lost in defense tnx to the Dbl.

If one is really to use the LOTT, then, according to Cohen (and commonsense) Qxx in opp suit should be a NEGATIVE adjustment (EVEN IF IT DISCLOSES THE TRUMP POSITION), lowering the number of total tricks available, and making it more appealing to defend than to bid, in borderline situations.

I have not enough experience to evaluate whether this is a "borderline situation" or not, but if one is to use the LOTT, here it would tell us to sit for the double, regqardles of any adjustments...

[hatchett]

I think this is close between pass and 5♠. Driving slam is a big overbid. If slam is making partner will bid it over 5S since a 5 level pull should normally have a reasonable expectation of making At IMPs I would lean towards a pass, expecting 500 most of the time 5S is making, and 5S to be off maybe 1/3 of the time.

[pbleighton]

"If double was takeout, it seems normal to bid 5♠. But is double takeout? I think standard is that it's just "values" and should only be removed with shape. If partner has a doubleton diamond, five spades is quite likely to be a disaster. In any case, suits are not breaking well on this hand, and there's no reason partner has to have four spades. I'll pass and take the plus score."

Agree.

Peter