[pescetom]

Not not too serious, but not messing around on Friday night either.
You are playing 2/1 with 15-17 1NT, 1♦ 4+, no Walsh.

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Your call now?

[jillybean]

1M may not deny 4 ♦'s but does 1D deny a 4cM?

It looks like 1♥ wtp?, if partner has 4H's I'd expect a courtesy raise.


"Not too serious" , just a sanctioned club game ?

[pescetom]

jillybean, on 2024-March-14, 19:35, said:

1M may not deny 4 ♦'s but does 1D deny a 4cM?

No it does not.

jillybean, on 2024-March-14, 19:35, said:

It looks like 1♥ wtp?, if partner has 4H's I'd expect a courtesy raise.

Some might consider it at the limit (like me), or even 2♥. Just testing.

jillybean, on 2024-March-14, 19:35, said:

"Not too serious" , just a sanctioned club game ?

Yup, but trying to win rather than have fun

[jillybean]

Yes, it's definitely at the limit but I trust my partner will keep it going if he has anything. Neither of us have limited our hand.

I am always trying to win ��

[Douglas43]

Looks like a reverse into 2♥ to me, but these aren't my methods so I may be way off-target (and I don't play this as GF, which is a minority view)

[Cyberyeti]

Douglas43, on 2024-March-15, 16:12, said:

Looks like a reverse into 2♥ to me, but these aren't my methods so I may be way off-target (and I don't play this as GF, which is a minority view)

I just bid 1♥ (forcing if partner really had a response) 2♥ shows a different hand type

[DavidKok]

I'd bid 1♥. Personally I much prefer not to jump on what is likely to be a strong auction. Partner will very rarely pass this, and if partner does it's almost certainly fine. Also did anybody notice the weird thing happening in the spade suit? How many does partner have? How many do the opponents have? If partner is weak, where are the points, and why aren't the opponents overcalling?
Some people like to jump to show stronger hands on this and similar auctions. Personally I think this is a poor decision - we are crowding our own auction for no real reason, and even with a gadget like Ingberman or Lebensohl we'll be in an uncomfortable spot frequently. And, as mentioned at the start of my comment, it hardly gains.

[mikeh]

Imo far too many people overbid good hands, and often the same people underbid weak hands that the auction tells one are much stronger than their original valuation.

This is a very nice hand but it’s not a game force opposite a minimum response absent (at the least) a good fit somewhere.

2H is almost universally played (and imo must be played, in a 2/1 or standard type method) as game force.

So 1H. It’s not forcing….not in the least. Again, imo, playing 1H or 1S as forcing is unwise and unnecessary.

Responder will almost never pass with any hand on which game looks decent, single dummy. I’m tempted to delete the ‘almost’ from that proposition….I cannot remember ever being passed in such a situation and finding that we’ve missed a game….and I’ve played a lot of bridge and tend to remember my bad boards more than my good ones.

Meanwhile, imagine partner with Qxx xxx Kxxxxx x. Maybe you don’t respond on those hands but I assure you that most (non forcing club) experts wouldn’t dream of passing 1C with this hand, for a number of reasons. As it happens, on this hand 1C is ok, but when not playing a Walsh style, he might have something like Kxxx AKxx Qx Jxx. Good luck in 1C. And if he instead has a 1N rebid, we hopefully play xyz and get to a good 2D contract. Meanwhile, by bidding, we may persuade the opps that we’ve got some values. And so on.

[mycroft]

I am in the same slot (with somewhat less experience) as Mike.

1♣-1♦; 1M is "non-forcing, but partner never passes".

And I have never passed that auction and missed game. And I have never had a partner pass that auction and miss game.

Sure, I've *made* game a couple of times, but that's not the same thing.

As for the hand in the OP, it's not close to a maximum (for me) for 1♥. Find a fit, and it's huge. But without a fit, I wouldn't be confident of making 1NT with "this great 17".

I have a warning flag with most of my partners; they will bypass diamonds to rebid 1♥ with hands less than invitational. So, we likely do not have a heart fit - but if we do, we're going to want room to investigate slam.

[sfi]

mycroft, on 2024-March-17, 16:18, said:

1♣-1♦; 1M is "non-forcing, but partner never passes".

I've often described it as "1M is as forcing as 1C was." That tends to get the message across.

[pescetom]

A useful consensus: thanks to all who replied here.