[ahydra]

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IMPs (Swiss). Nobody vul. 1NT = 12-14, and a double of 2H would show hearts (basic agreements so no idea what partner would take 2S over 2H as). Double now is for takeout.

ahydra

[gordontd]

X seems normal.

[FelicityR]

I'm opening the North hand so you don't have to make a decision later, but if as here you have to make a call later in the auction I'd rather compete with Double than Pass lamely.

[gszes]

I consider this X to be decent mainly because NOTHING IN MY HAND IS WORSE OFF having the 1n bidder behind me. Give me 2k 2q 1j same distribution and pass happens in less than a heartbeat. My hand quality is the deciding factor not merely the lameness of passing:))

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

dependes on mood, and on your agreements, what a bids partner had av. over the 1NT.
We can show 4+H-4?, and partner does not need to have opening strength 8/9HCP in the
given position / vul. is sufficent.
Given this, we wont have a heart fit, but we still may have a minor suit fit.
Most likely I would go with Pass.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[rmnka447]

This is a classic dilemma hand over a weak NT. Do you or don't you come in?

RHO can be anywhere from 4-5 to a decent 10 count (i.e., not quite enough for 2 NT)


You have about as good as possible hand that you could pass and then double. With the doubleton ♠, I'm doubling at NV. I'd very likely pass at VUL.

[wank]

It would be auto at MP. I pass at imps.

Aside from the risk of getting smacked, you'll often force partner to convert a plus score on defence into a minus score on offence. He obviously won't be expecting A9 of trumps.

[ahydra]

Thanks all. Looks like wank and P_Marlowe come out on top, as the full hand was:

---

Partner tried her hardest in 3C but went down, with 2S also down. East afterwards was saying that she should have doubled.

ahydra

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

if East always doubles with his hand, I will join the double club, not caring
for the current result.
Sorry: Pass by East is clear, if he doubles, he should expect 3Cx=, over tricks /
XX possible.

As it is, the passed hand has all the Aces, that would cover Easts Kings.
Next time the Ace of Clubs switches place with either major suit Ace and
that is that.

As I said, if South could have entered the bidding with a 4+H and 5+m hand and
roughly 10/11HCP, than the failure to do so, reduces the appeal of reopening,
if he does not have a bid for this hand type, get in, ..., and this is regardless
of MP/ IMP.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Cyberyeti]

P_Marlowe, on 2018-July-03, 04:33, said:

Hi,

if East always doubles with his hand, I will join the double club, not caring
for the current result.
Sorry: Pass by East is clear, if he doubles, he should expect 3Cx=, over tricks /
XX possible.

As it is, the passed hand has all the Aces, that would cover Easts Kings.
Next time the Ace of Clubs switches place with either major suit Ace and
that is that.

As I said, if South could have entered the bidding with a 4+H and 5+m hand and
roughly 10/11HCP, than the failure to do so, reduces the appeal of reopening,
if he does not have a bid for this hand type, get in, ..., and this is regardless
of MP/ IMP.

With kind regards
Marlowe

E never doubles with this, if they do, partner has a zero count with 6 spades.

I'd have opened 1N with the N hand and played there (the S hand is to me a 10 count not an 11 count so doesn't raise).

I like the N hand, I'm somewhat surprised K&R rates it at 10.95, I rate it at 11.5, it agrees with me about the S hand (10.2).

[nullve]

ahydra, on 2018-July-03, 03:02, said:

Thanks all. Looks like wank and P_Marlowe come out on top, as the full hand was:

---

Partner tried her hardest in 3C but went down, with 2S also down. East afterwards was saying that she should have doubled.

ahydra

---

What's going on here?

I don't know the EW system, but the fact that West didn't open strongly suggests that he has only 5 spades. And the fact that East didn't superaccept is an indication he has only 2-3 S. So, depending on partner's balancing tendencies, he might be a huge favourite to hold exactly 2 spades.

Assuming he is, then naïve LoTT suggests bidding, since there will be around 16 total trumps on average. But 4 trumps and 333 shape is a considerable negative adjustment factor (so-called!), and holding a quack in their trumps suit certinaly doesn't help, either, so I think South should expect only 15 total tricks. Then passing is clearly right if e.g. they're divided 9-6 or 8-7 in our favour, and not a total disaster at IMPs if they're divided 7-8 and opps would have doubled 3♣. So maybe South should pass? I know I would.

[Cyberyeti]

nullve, on 2018-July-03, 07:10, said:

---

What's going on here?

I don't know the EW system, but the fact that West didn't open strongly suggests that he has only 5 spades. And the fact that East didn't superaccept is an indication he has only 2-3 S. So, depending on partner's balancing tendencies, he might be a huge favourite to hold exactly 2 spades.

Assuming he is, then naïve LoTT suggests bidding, since there will be around 16 total trumps on average. But 4 trumps and 333 shape is a considerable negative adjustment factor (so-called!), and holding a quack in their trumps suit certinaly doesn't help, either, so I think South should expect only 15 total tricks. Then passing is clearly right if e.g. they're divided 9-6 or 8-7 in our favour, and not a total disaster at IMPs if they're divided 7-8 and opps would have doubled 3♣. So maybe South should pass? I know I would.

20:20 hindsight, partner is at least 2:1 to hold 4 clubs. The real danger is that W holds 6 spades and not enough for a first seat weak 2 by their methods (if they're playing 6-10 this is not unlikely). Prime example KJxxxx, xx, 10xxx, x with partner holding x, KJxx, KJxx, QJxx and the 1N bidder Axx, Axxx, AQ9, xxx, now 2♠x makes lots of tricks and 3♣ at least comes close and may make if they don't whistle diamonds through.

If opps open much lighter weak 2s in first seat then your view is more reasonable.

[Winstonm]

Besides the obvious reason of not knowing the weak NT responder's strength, the main reason to pass this hand is that there is no guarantee that the opponents have a fit - this is not the same auction as 1S-P-2S-P-P-P - so the inference that we have an 8-card fit cannot be claimed. Climbing in at the 3-level with little-to-no assurance of a fit is a good way to turn a positive score into a negative score.

[Cyberyeti]

Winstonm, on 2018-July-03, 09:55, said:

Besides the obvious reason of not knowing the weak NT responder's strength, the main reason to pass this hand is that there is no guarantee that the opponents have a fit - this is not the same auction as 1S-P-2S-P-P-P - so the inference that we have an 8-card fit cannot be claimed. Climbing in at the 3-level with little-to-no assurance of a fit is a good way to turn a positive score into a negative score.

Opps are known to have a fit of 8-9 cards, partner doesn't find the reopening double with a hand he couldn't open unless they do.

[dokoko]

Cyberyeti, on 2018-July-03, 10:00, said:

Opps are known to have a fit of 8-9 cards, partner doesn't find the reopening double with a hand he couldn't open unless they do.

I guess winstonm talked of North not knowing about opps' fit.