[Vampyr]

Match points. You have not discussed this specific auction.

---

Unfortunately I do not positively remember whether N/S were vulnerable or not. Would this change your answer?

[P_Marlowe]

Penalty.

The only other option is a good spade raise, you may call it game try.
The problem with that: 2S may be an OBAR bid, vulnerability matters,
if you have agreed to play OBAR, the number of hands that want to make
a game try is low, very low.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Vampyr]

P_Marlowe, on 2017-October-30, 14:19, said:

Penalty.

The only other option is a good spade raise, you may call it game try.
The problem with that: 2S may be an OBAR bid, vulnerability matters,
if you have agreed to play OBAR, the number of hands that want to make
a game try is low, very low.

With kind regards
Marlowe

Have no idea what OBAR means, but partner does not wander into a live auction without values.

OBAR = OverBidding At Random?

[johnu]

P_Marlowe, on 2017-October-30, 14:19, said:

The only other option is a good spade raise, you may call it game try.
The problem with that: 2S may be an OBAR bid, vulnerability matters,
if you have agreed to play OBAR, the number of hands that want to make
a game try is low, very low.

AKA Maximal Doubles.

If 2♠ could be an OBAR bid, do you really want to make a penalty double?

[wank]

you can play it as a good raise.

you can play it as penalty.

you can play it as takeout - can easily have like a 2245 12 count here.

absent agreement i would think penalties.

[Vampyr]

I have discovered that OBAR means pre-balancing. We would not do this as an unpassed hand; we do not want to have to use fancy methods when we have a real hand.

[sfi]

Vampyr, on 2017-October-30, 19:00, said:

I have discovered that OBAR means pre-balancing. We would not do this as an unpassed hand; we do not want to have to use fancy methods when we have a real hand.

You aren't so far off in your initial acronym effort - at least in practical terms. From memory, the full acronym is OBARBIDS, which stands for "Opponents Bid and Raise, Balance in Direct Seat". The concept was introduced by noted conservative bidder Marty Bergen in his book on the contested auction.

The basic idea is sound - if they have a fit you should want to get into the auction - but it can be taken too far.

[The_Badger]

There's competitiveness, and there's competitiveness. In my view, if a player wants to bid 2♠ vulnerable under the opening bidder after two vulnerable opponents have bid and his partner has passed, he should have a half-decent hand. If he hasn't got a half-decent hand, he lets his partner balance if 2♥ is not raised, knowing full well that his partner didn't have an ideal hand to overcall or make a takeout double on the first round of bidding.

As wank says you can take the Dbl. any way you like with agreement. Without agreement I would take it strictly as penalties, partner being over the opening bidder, but I would look at how many hearts I am holding in my own hand as the 2♠ bidder before making a definitive decision.

[Vampyr]

The_Badger, on 2017-October-31, 06:10, said:

There's competitiveness, and there's competitiveness. In my view, if a player wants to bid 2♠ vulnerable under the opening bidder after two vulnerable opponents have bid and his partner has passed, he should have a half-decent hand. If he hasn't got a half-decent hand, he lets his partner balance if 2♥ is not raised, knowing full well that his partner didn't have an ideal hand to overcall or make a takeout double on the first round of bidding.

As wank says you can take the Dbl. any way you like with agreement. Without agreement I would take it strictly as penalties, partner being over the opening bidder, but I would look at how many hearts I am holding in my own hand as the 2♠ bidder before making a definitive decision.

Well, you have two.

[gszes]

Its just too infrequent that xing the 9 card trump suit opps is a good idea. If 3h is a poor contract you will score well anyway but it wont be a slaughter. It is vastly more important to be able to show values to compete rather than saving this x for penalty. What kind of hand is more common? Kx KQTx Axx xxxx or Kx xxxx AQx Kxxx (or some such)? Hnad type 2 would seem to have many more possiblities AND how can those possibilites show themselves if 3hx is for penalty. Yes we will lose a BIG score once in a while but the big majority of the time we will compete far more effectively. I feel this x is more like a tox w/o having the suit requirements and some spade tolerance (other).