[Endymion77]

Zelandakh said:

About 10-12/13-15 I would think.

I wouldn't dare to bid 1♠ if I know my partner would be forced to jump to 2NT with 13 balanced in response

[Antrax]

Cyberyeti, on 2014-January-20, 06:09, said:

I presume if you overcall on 6-18, you might want it NF, but I'd always play it forcing

So responder's only forcing bid is cue? Do people play that?

[Zelandakh]

Endymion77, on 2014-January-20, 10:51, said:

I wouldn't dare to bid 1♠ if I know my partner would be forced to jump to 2NT with 13 balanced in response

Once again,

Zelandakh, on 2014-January-20, 10:11, said:

I would think. It depends a little what range the overcall showed and therefore what the minimum for partner's advance is.

If your bottom range for 1♠ is different then your NT ranges adjust to that. The reason for CY's question was precisely that he does play different ranges for these calls.

[Endymion77]

Right, if 1♠ is 10+ then I guess it won't hurt much to rebid 2NT with 13 balanced. But then you're stuck with a lot of hands that need to pass 1♥ and really shouldn't which was my point.

[Endymion77]

Antrax, on 2014-January-20, 10:58, said:

So responder's only forcing bid is cue? Do people play that?

If you play 1♠ non-forcing, then you have a cue or a jump shift (which is usually a fit jump) as forcing. Of course, even though 1♠ is non-forcing it doesn't mean that overcaller would drop it with an opening hand (even a light opening hand).

[kenberg]

Antrax, on 2014-January-20, 10:58, said:

So responder's only forcing bid is cue? Do people play that?

Added: Simultaneously posted with the above.

Yes, I do. (1♣)-1♦-(P)-2♠ is effectively forcing. I suppose it is best played as spades plus diamond support so that second hand, with spade support knows of the double fit and partner's good strength and w/o spades he retreats to the known diamond fit. If it just shows spades, and I often play that it just shows spades, it shows a good suit and a good hand. If second hand has any sort of decent overcall he presumably will want to go on but he is, as I like to play, allowed to pass.

I have not much found it a probelm to have (1♣)-1♦-(P)-1♠ as NF. Partner will raise spades if he has them, and if he doesn't I am probably happy to have my suit in at the one level. Give me, as fourht hand, mayb AQJxx in spades and some scatters other values, for example Kx in diamonds, and I would be delighted to bid a non-forcing 1♠. I can perhaps scramble seven tricks if this is passed out and it seldom is passed out.

[Zelandakh]

Endymion77, on 2014-January-20, 11:16, said:

Right, if 1♠ is 10+ then I guess it won't hurt much to rebid 2NT with 13 balanced. But then you're stuck with a lot of hands that need to pass 1♥ and really shouldn't which was my point.

And if 9+, 22+hcp + shape + knowing where the hcp are will usually be enough to bring it home. If your 1 level overcall is higher and you need to advance on 7+ to avoid missing games then 20+hcp probably will not get the job done. Whether you should or should not pass as Advancer depends on the range of the overcall. If you play a traditional style (~15 max) then your bottom end is less than if you play the top end as 18, which you sometimes see. If your overcall range is very wide then you end up having to do the "clever" things to try and get some control and safety back into procedings.

[P_Marlowe]

X.

1NT is too modern for me.

Over 1S from partner, I will pass.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Antrax]

What's your follow-up to 2♠?

[P_Marlowe]

Antrax, on 2014-January-21, 03:27, said:

What's your follow-up to 2♠?

Assuming the request was directed at me ...

3C, stopper / half stopper ask, partner can introduce a new
4 card suit on the way.

With kind regards
Marlowe