[blackshoe]

monikrazy, on 2014-January-18, 12:13, said:

Perhaps this has changed in Max Hardy's most recent works but I have two books of his (2/1 revised expanded and Standard Bidding in the 21st Century) and his only mention of Walsh bidding is for Walsh Relays after 1NT opens.

Max Hardy passed away in late 2002. His last book, published in the year of his death, was Advanced Bridge Bidding for the 21st Century, the sequel to his penultimate book Standard Bridge Bidding for the 21st Century. Actually, the two volumes are one book, each chapter having been split and treated in the second volume as a continuation of the corresponding chapter in the first. Walsh responses are mentioned briefly on pp. 88-89 of the first volume, and in much greater detail on pp. 66 ff. of the second. 2/1 Revised and Expanded, if memory serves, was published in 1985 or thereabouts.

[kenrexford]

So what did he say in ABB 21ST about the 2H raise?

[JLOGIC]

I think a hand type like xxx KQx Axxxx xx is a legit enough hand type to worry about that bidding 2H with that is a good idea. It is not a huge deal, but arguably neither is playing 1S denies 4 hearts, you have so much room over 1S (opener is fairly well defined, and responder has shown diamonds and a GF, and you're still at 1S). And opener gets to make a third bid to describe his hand at the 1N or 2 level which seems efficient for slam bidding.

Ken, I'm sure you could even use your cuebidding methods in an auction like 1C 1D 1H 1S* anything, 2H. Openers shape is well defined, you're in a game force, and you have established a fit. Seems very similar to something like 1H 2C 2D 2H. Of course, you can do the same thing over 1C 1D 1H 2H in your methods too, even with opener being less defined, but I think you lose a hand type that would otherwise like to bid 2H (my initial example hand).

As for the actual hand of course 2C is a bad bid, Joel Wooldridge tried to convince me that weak 7-4s should rebid 2C (I was unconvinced but it seemed to have merit if you allowed it systemically), but this hand is far from a weak 7-4, it's a very strong hand.

[blackshoe]

kenrexford, on 2014-January-18, 21:18, said:

So what did he say in ABB 21ST about the 2H raise?

Nothing specific. He concentrates on opener's rebid with a balanced hand - which should bypass a four card major, since unless responder is planning to keep bidding, he won't have one. On the auction 1♣-1♦-1♥-2♥, I feel confident that Hardy would say that opener has shown an unbalanced hand and that responder's raise is GF.

On the question of "standard" 2/1 let me say first that I think the word "standard" should be stricken from the language. I'll go on: historically, two different approaches to 2/1 developed in North America: one on the East Coast, and the other on the West Coast. One significant difference between the two is the use of Walsh, which is a West Coast thing. Another is the meaning of a minimum rebid of responder's 2/1 in a minor, e.g., 1♠-2♣-2♦-3♣. In the West Coast style, this is still GF. In the East Coast style, it shows an invitational hand with long clubs (six or more). So what's "standard" 2/1 depends, at least in part, on where you're from.

[mikestar13]

Her's a sequence that works in ultra-vanilla 2/1 where neither partner has ever heard of Walsh and the partnership bids 4 card suits up the line:

1♣-1♦;
1♥-4♥;
4NT-5♠;
6♥

I'm assuming the partnership doesn't know RCKB either, so 5♠ shows 3 Aces.


This is how I would have bid with an average partner circa 1977.

Methods aren't the key here--it's that West needs to realize that this is about the best 13-count he will see in his life and bid accordingly (I'd estimate the playing value of West's hand to be about 19-20.)

[P_Marlowe]

1C - 1D
2C - 2H (1)
3S (2) - 4D (3)
4NT - 5D
5H - 6H

(1) Even not playing Walsh, this should show 5+ D, 4+ hearts and inv.+ strength
(2) Splinter, openers most likely shape is 5431, or 6421
(3) Cue, Ace or King, showing some SI, SI due to the control richness

With kind regards
Marlowe

PS: I do think hand is too strong for 2C, the hand is worth a reverse,
so over 1D, opener should show the 4 card heart suit, as was stated by others,
but I used the start, that was given at the table.