[whereagles]

Suppose you're playing sayc or 2/1. The bidding is

1m 1♥
2♠

I suppose you play this as forcing, but how forcing should it be? Game forcing, or just forcing for 1 round?

[mr1303]

Traditionally this is played as GF. I suppose you could play some kind of Blackout here where you say "Sorry I responded" and the next bid becomes not forcing, but I don't think this is standard

[luke warm]

i play it as a 1 round force... 2C could have been opened for a game force

[flytoox]

I think this is GF, especially if 1S is not forcing. So it is better to play 2S as GF. Some play 1S as forcing, in this case, perhaps 2S can be some kind of picture bidding.

[inquiry]

I play this as one round force. It is game force, unless responder bids 2NT here (I play lebehnsol over reverse, where 2NT is the way responder screams weakness). Over this 2NT, if opener rebids 3♣ we can stop short of game. Anything other than 3♣ is game force.

Look up lebehnshol over reverse for more on this treatement.

Ben

[mcphee]

A jump shift is Forcing to game, this is the standard agreement. Playing lebensohl over this j/s is not a standard agreement, even thou I like to do that myself and think it makes perfect sense.

[inquiry]

mcphee, on Jan 31 2005, 12:45 PM, said:

A jump shift is Forcing to game, this is the standard agreement. Playing lebensohl over this j/s is not a standard agreement, even thou I like to do that myself and think it makes perfect sense.

In BridgeBase Online "advanced" lebehnshol over reverse is "standard". In BridgeWorld standard, opener’s reverse after a one-level suit response is forcing and promises opener will make rebid if below game (but very pointedly does not say is game force... a double jump, however is).

[TimG]

inquiry, on Jan 31 2005, 11:53 AM, said:

mcphee, on Jan 31 2005, 12:45 PM, said:

A jump shift is Forcing to game, this is the standard agreement. Playing lebensohl over this j/s is not a standard agreement, even thou I like to do that myself and think it makes perfect sense.

In BridgeBase Online "advanced" lebehnshol over reverse is "standard".

But, this ain't no stinkin' reverse.

[pclayton]

If I'm playing my usual 2/1, its a game force. Lebensohl applies, so does fast arrival.

If I'm playing my 2♣ / 2♦ openers, right now its a virtual force. But we are toying with making this a mini-splinter, since 1m - 1♥ - 1♠ carries the same level of force.

In my old strong club partnership, this just showed a 6-5 and a 14-15 count (1♦ opener of course).

[Free]

I play this as 1 round forcing, since it's 15+ reverse

Even with standard agreements, I think this is F1, not GF. 3m is usually signoff without any other methods.

[fred]

Opener's jump shift rebid is forcing to game in "standard".

I don't think anyone knows if this is the "best" way to play, but I have always played this way in my regular partnerships.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[bearmum]

I prefer to play it as 1 round force

[mike777]

Good Grief Charlie Brown.

You better play this as 100% game force without a detailed agreement otherwise.
This is a jumpshift, not a reverse.

BTW just read an interesting bridge article where many top world class experts said they would never pass opening bid of 1C or 1D with a stiff or void if they have 5 card major and zero pts.

[HeartA]

I play it as "forcing one round". It is a jump-shift, it is also a reverse.

2C opening doesn't force to game either, imo. It only forces to 3M or 4m. In other words, 2C forces 2 rounds.

[fred]

HeartA, on Jan 31 2005, 11:12 PM, said:

I play it as "forcing one round". It is a jump-shift, it is also a reverse.

2C opening doesn't force to game either, imo. It only forces to 3M or 4m. In other words, 2C forces 2 rounds.

I don't really want to get into a debate about naming things, but in all the bridge literature I have ever read, this auction is referred to as a "jump shift" (and reverses are always bids that are not jumps).

Maybe all the confusion about this sequence is a result of confusion about names. In standard bidding (whatever that means) "jump shifts" are forcing to game, but "reverses" are only forcing for 1 round.

If you want to play your jump shifts as one round forces that's up to you, but I strongly suggest you discuss this with your partner. Jeff Rubens, the editor of The Bridge World, has been campaigning to make jump shifts only forcing for 1 round in "Bridge World Standard", but as far as I can tell few if any of the world's leading players are jumping on this particular bandwagon.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[Double !]

What would you rebid after opening 1♣ -p-1♥-p-? holding the following:
♠Axx,♥x,xx,♣AKQxxxx ? (.....hope that adds up to 13 cards)

[HeartA]

Double !, on Jan 31 2005, 07:43 PM, said:

What would you rebid after opening 1♣ -p-1♥-p-? holding the following:
♠Axx,♥x,xx,♣AKQxxxx ? (.....hope that adds up to 13 cards)

I would bid 3NT

[flytoox]

HeartA, on Feb 1 2005, 01:21 AM, said:

Double !, on Jan 31 2005, 07:43 PM, said:

What would you rebid after opening 1♣ -p-1♥-p-?  holding the following:
♠Axx,♥x,xx,♣AKQxxxx  ?  (.....hope that adds up to 13 cards)

I would bid 3NT

Agree. Throw science out of my window.

[mr1303]

I'm going to be wet and bid 3C.

Can see that 3NT may be right, but it may be wrong as well. To lie and bid 2S her (which is what you were getting at I reckon) is a dreadful bid, and will get exactly what it deserves