[han]

Scoring: IMP

1D-(p)-1H-(1S)
??

---

Assume you play standard methods, whatever that means. Do you agree with 1D? What do you bid now?

[keylime]

LHO is going to speak in spades here and we might be outgunned.

If I say 4H, which most will say probably, 4S on my left, and back at me trying to decide whether to hit 5S or not. If we lack a club fit, our hand is pure enough for nearly 6H.

I think you got to drive hard for game here and tell pard the spade situation in terms of a possible five level battle -> at least 3♠ splinter from me to get to 4H.

Here in D.C. they'd open 1H over 1D; style thing.

[mike777]

Hannie, on Aug 17 2007, 09:52 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

1D-(p)-1H-(1S)
??

---

Assume you play standard methods, whatever that means. Do you agree with 1D? What do you bid now?

Agree.

6H now.

[the hog]

Object to 1D. I would have opened 1H. The hand is not strong enough in terms of HCP to reverse to show the H suit. Bid 3S now.

[mikeh]

Jlall, on Aug 17 2007, 10:58 PM, said:

3S, I will not sit for a X of 4S.

It seems to me that the sequence 3♠ then 5♥ should partner double is stronger than the sequence 4♥ then 5♥.

And it also seems to me that 4♥ is preemptive in nature: a good raise would go through 2♠ or 3♠.

So I bid 4♥. Now I could trust partner: if he doubles 4♠, he should know that I have a wild hand, not a power raise... but I'd still pull

[han]

I was wondering whether everybody was comfortable bidding to the game-level with so few HCP. For us this wasn't a problem because we never open 1D with a strong balanced hand so we can bid 2NT with a HCP raise to 4H; 4H really showed this kind of hand.

Arend had AQxx AQ10x x Jxxx and passed 4H, making on the nose when suits split badly.

[jdonn]

Slightly different question. What do people rebid with no interference, 1♦ p 1♥ p ?

[mikeh]

Jlall, on Aug 17 2007, 11:54 PM, said:

I don't think 2S should ever contain 4 card heart support. There was a MSC poll similar to this a while ago, do you remember it because my memory is a little fuzzy? I think the options were "always shows support, never shows support, may or may not have support" and the latter was the most popular which would mean I'm a minority view here. This could certainly change the meanings of the bids.

I play, according to partner's wishes, either always support or may or may not have 4 card support... I prefer the latter, and my post was based on that (unspoken) assumption. I agree with your posts if playing it denies 4 card support

[kgr]

Jlall, on Aug 18 2007, 06:55 AM, said:

jdonn, on Aug 17 2007, 11:52 PM, said:

Slightly different question. What do people rebid with no interference, 1♦ p 1♥ p ?

3H

Is 3H forcing here?
Why with interference you bid 3S and without interference not? 3S is also a splinter now?
In my system 2S would be splinter and I would bid that.

[helene_t]

kgr, on Aug 18 2007, 12:21 PM, said:

Jlall, on Aug 18 2007, 06:55 AM, said:

jdonn, on Aug 17 2007, 11:52 PM, said:

Slightly different question. What do people rebid with no interference, 1♦ p 1♥ p ?

3H

Is 3H forcing here?
Why with interference you bid 3S and without interference not? 3S is also a splinter now?
In my system 2S would be splinter and I would bid that.

3♥ is not forcing, and 3♠ is a splinter whether there is interference or not.

I'm not sure whether this hand qualifies for a splinter, but I'm slightly more tempted to splinter with interference than without. With interference, it's important to show you shortness so that you can respect p's penalty double on 4♠.

[kgr]

helene_t, on Aug 18 2007, 12:32 PM, said:

kgr, on Aug 18 2007, 12:21 PM, said:

Jlall, on Aug 18 2007, 06:55 AM, said:

jdonn, on Aug 17 2007, 11:52 PM, said:

Slightly different question. What do people rebid with no interference, 1♦ p 1♥ p ?

3H

Is 3H forcing here?
Why with interference you bid 3S and without interference not? 3S is also a splinter now?
In my system 2S would be splinter and I would bid that.

3♥ is not forcing, and 3♠ is a splinter whether there is interference or not.

I'm not sure whether this hand qualifies for a splinter, but I'm slightly more tempted to splinter with interference than without. With interference, it's important to show you shortness so that you can respect p's penalty double on 4♠.

Difficult to believe that Justin wants to bid 3H NF here. If partner has ♥A then 4♥ has changes.
What is the 'standard' point range for the splinter here? Probably stronger then this hand?
You expect LHO to bid Spades here, so is it really that different then RHO overcalling ♠'s... Except that you make it clear for opps that they have a ♠ fit if you splinter.

[jdonn]

kgr, on Aug 18 2007, 05:38 AM, said:

Difficult to believe that Justin wants to bid 3H NF here. If partner has ♥A then 4♥ has changes.
What is the 'standard' point range for the splinter here? Probably stronger then this hand?
You expect LHO to bid Spades here, so is it really that different then RHO overcalling ♠'s... Except that you make it clear for opps that they have a ♠ fit if you splinter.

People who know Justin well know that he bids 3♥ on hands where some would bid 4, but he accepts over the 3♥ bid VERY aggressively, so for him it's not dangerous at all. I agree with his style there. It's possible he would miss game only if partner had Axxx of hearts and nothing else in his hand, in which case the opponents with 26 points and at least 9 spades would not be passing. In fact, I think he is more likely to get to game going down, if partner has Qxxx or worse of hearts with wasted black suit values and hearts aren't friendly, than he is to miss game.

[pclayton]

I'm with Justin on most of his points:

1. 3S and 4H tend to show about the same playing strength, although since 4H is more balanced it shows more controls but less shape. There's nothing preemptive about 4H.

2. 2S absolutely denies 4 card support.

3. I can't construct a hand that would bid 4H and wouldn't sit for a double of 4S. As a matter of fact, this hand will be doubling a lot of the time itself.

Without the spade overcall, I'm still jamming this into game with a 3S call. There are too many 5 counts that make 4H and too many 10 counts that give us slam.

[skjaeran]

Jlall, on Aug 18 2007, 08:42 PM, said:

kgr, on Aug 18 2007, 05:21 AM, said:

Jlall, on Aug 18 2007, 06:55 AM, said:

jdonn, on Aug 17 2007, 11:52 PM, said:

Slightly different question. What do people rebid with no interference, 1♦ p 1♥ p ?

3H

Is 3H forcing here?

No.

Quote

Difficult to believe that Justin wants to bid 3H NF here. If partner has ♥A then 4♥ has changes

Yes, but partner doesn't have the ace of hearts and out if the opponents have BOTH not bid (remember the auction will have been 1D p 1H p ?). Don't worry, there is a zero percent chance that partner will pass 3H given our hand and the opponents silence.

Quote

You expect LHO to bid Spades here, so is it really that different then RHO overcalling ♠'s... Except that you make it clear for opps that they have a ♠ fit if you splinter.

He passed 1D so I don't expect him to bid anything.

Quote

Without the spade overcall, I'm still jamming this into game with a 3S call. There are too many 5 counts that make 4H and too many 10 counts that give us slam.

Yes, but again, partner doesn't have these hands.


The question is are we more likely to miss a good slam or get to a bad slam by bidding 3S. Considering 3H is, imo, the normal action with a random balanced 18 count, and the normal action with a 15 count and a stiff, I'm just not worried about missing slam by bidding 3H. I am worried that partner, who pretty much is guaranteed to have some black suit wastage will have simply too good of a hand to stop below the 5 level after our 3S bid (think, random 14 count, even wtih AQ of spades or something he will get us too high).

I admit I'd most probably have bid 4♥ at the table in this position.

But I wholeheartedly agree with everything Justin said above.

[Halo]

What does 2S over 1S show for you guys?