[thepossum]

New minor forcing. How would you bid to explore game or part score (and strain)

Would you bid honestly like me and bid hearts or not - that is supposedly the priority bid is it not


Does it affect how the defence may play - or only with robots - does it affect how you play with Humans

MPs Robot tourney - you the Human are South (an assumption that ChatGPT isn't reading the forum yet) - but imagine other humans too

---

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

3H.

2H showes a min, and you have a max., it also implies exactly 2 spades,
i.e. if partner insists on spades, he will have 6+ spades.
The 1NT rebid was not the book rebid, but there are worse crimes.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[bluenikki]

 P_Marlowe, on 2023-May-23, 23:26, said:

The 1NT rebid was not the book rebid, but there are worse crimes.

Such as rebidding 2♦

[P_Marlowe]

 bluenikki, on 2023-May-24, 06:37, said:

Such as rebidding 2♦

The book bid is 2D, in my opinion, but I have not read a bridge book in a long time,
and I guess it is a matter of philosophy (*).

I recall a lesson with a Bermuda Bow Quarter Finalist, they may even have reached
the semi final, who said, he will always be semi bal., when making a 1NT rebid,
the consequence being, that responder should rebid his
5 card suit, there will always be 5-2 fit, making the long suit of the weak hand trumps.

Now 1-2 weeks later, I was playing an individual tournament, I was facing him, he made
the 1NT rebid, and I had to decide, to rebid my 5 carder or not, passing would have the
add. benefit, he gets to play the hand.

Long story short, I passed, he had a single spade, the score was great.
We did not say anything, but he had noticed, that I was thinking.

(*) Playing with bots, I would be wary to promise length I don have, they may send me to
stupid contracts, ..., it happends anyway.

[Gilithin]

 P_Marlowe, on 2023-May-23, 23:26, said:

3H.

2H showes a min, and you have a max., it also implies exactly 2 spades,
i.e. if partner insists on spades, he will have 6+ spades.
The 1NT rebid was not the book rebid, but there are worse crimes.

The German (and French) bidding methodology is somewhat different from other parts of the world and you have to be careful when making definitive posts based on it, particularly in the N/B forum. Germans love to jump over NMF, 4SF and other such bids; most others do not. There is nothing wrong with using a system that bids 2♥ rather than 3♥ with a maximum. If Responder has an invitational hand, they can ask min/max by the simple method of raising to 3 and sometimes the extra level of bidding can be useful. Similarly German and French players are taught never to rebid NT with a singleton or raise on Opener's rebid with 3 card support. That is fine within the context of those systems but the English speaking world (of which Australia still qualifies) mostly uses a somewhat different approach that aims to reach better contracts overall rather than looking better on paper. The truth is that both approaches have their merits so telling that one of them is "the book rebid" without further explanation is doing them a disservice.

Back to the hand, your partner is in control after you choose 1NT so you now describe your hand as best you can. Whether that will be 2♥, 3♥ or something else depends on the system you are using. With a generic Aussie pick up partner playing some generic 5and strong system, I would choose 2♥. With GIB, I'll look through the meanings of the rebids and select accordingly.

[pescetom]

Italians too are taught never to rebid 1NT with a singleton and to rebid 2D here (after 1NT-2C the question is moot, because responder's 2C would usually be either natural or an XYZ Puppet demanding 2D).

[allpass]

I would bid 2♥ here. Partner has shown at least invitational strength, so 2♥ is not a reverse. Do not bid 3♥, that would be an overbid. For details, this new minor forcing page covers this particular auction.

[Gilithin]

 allpass, on 2023-October-14, 12:55, said:

I would bid 2♥ here. Partner has shown at least invitational strength, so 2♥ is not a reverse. Do not bid 3♥, that would be an overbid. For details, this new minor forcing page covers this particular auction.

As I pointed out in my previous post, conventions are played differently in different parts of the world. Quoting a specific resource and stating that this is the definitive truth is simply incorrect. Whether 2♥, 3♥ or something else is correct depends on the system being played. A reverse is by definition Opener's or Responder's first rebid. 2♥ is not a reverse after a 1NT rebid regardless of what strength partner's 2♣ shows.

[allpass]

 Gilithin, on 2023-October-14, 15:29, said:

As I pointed out in my previous post, conventions are played differently in different parts of the world. Quoting a specific resource and stating that this is the definitive truth is simply incorrect. Whether 2♥, 3♥ or something else is correct depends on the system being played. A reverse is by definition Opener's or Responder's first rebid. 2♥ is not a reverse after a 1NT rebid regardless of what strength partner's 2♣ shows.

... So after all that, you're saying we agree that 2♥ is not a reverse?

Having already fudged 1NT with a singleton spade, I would never bid 3♥ opposite a potential misfit. My citizenship in any given part of the world, I believe, is irrelevant in that decision.

[Gilithin]

 allpass, on 2023-October-14, 19:31, said:

... So after all that huffing, you're saying we agree that 2♥ is not a reverse? Please show me any definition of NMF "in different parts of the world" where someone would bid 3♥ with this hand. And explain why it makes sense.

I suggest you start by reading the very first response in this thread from Uwe and then doing a little research about French and German bidding methods. You can expand out from there if it interests you further.