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Strong double? Double then bid

#1 User is offline   ilkleyivan 

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Posted 2021-September-04, 15:41

If I make a takeout double and my partner passes, would I be showing a very strong hand if I then made a suit bid?

E.g. As North, would my 3C bid be showing a very strong hand?


How many points does 3C bid show?


Would it show the same strength as here, where I change suit after parter does respond?


How many points does 3C bid show?

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#2 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2021-September-04, 15:54

View Postilkleyivan, on 2021-September-04, 15:41, said:

If I make a takeout double and my partner passes, would I be showing a very strong hand if I then made a suit bid?

E.g. As North, would my 3C bid be showing a very strong hand?


How many points does 3C bid show?


Would it show the same strength as here, where I change suit after parter does respond?


How many points does 3C bid show?


3C shows a strong hand with a long suit. With a strong hand and no shorty suit, other than hearts, youd double again.

With a weaker hand and long clubs, youd overcall 2C rather than doubling 1H

With a weaker hand and no long suit, youd pass 2H

Id expect something like Axx x Kxx AKQxxx on the low end in terms of strength.
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#3 User is offline   mikl_plkcc 

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Posted 2021-September-05, 10:40

View Postilkleyivan, on 2021-September-04, 15:41, said:

If I make a takeout double and my partner passes, would I be showing a very strong hand if I then made a suit bid?

E.g. As North, would my 3C bid be showing a very strong hand?


How many points does 3C bid show?


Would it show the same strength as here, where I change suit after parter does respond?


How many points does 3C bid show?



I treat both as strong hands, but with the first slightly weaker than the second at a balancing position.

The actual point count of "double then bid" depends on the shape, the distribution of points, and whether there is a stopper in the opponent's suit. I consider minimum 16 as a guideline as a "double then bid" hand in an uncontested auction, where 8-15 is the range of a simple overcall with a good suit.

However, in the first example, I may reopen the bidding with a slightly weaker hand is the bid suit is rather than , for example:
AK873-AJ93QT82

In the above hand, I will pass the second example after partner bids 2, but I will reopen with 2 in the first example hoping partner can compete.
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#4 User is offline   apollo1201 

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Posted 2021-September-06, 15:25

View Postmikl_plkcc, on 2021-September-05, 10:40, said:

AK873-AJ93QT82
In the above hand, I will pass the second example after partner bids 2, but I will reopen with 2 in the first example hoping partner can compete.

I think it is the other way round. You overcall 1S and then balance X to show a max overcall with support for the un bid suits. To me, X then 2S would be at least a K better. And (gotta check with partner, though) probably not so pure in terms of shape, rather 5233 but even stronger, or 51(43) or 6133, 62(32).

But to answer the OP, X then new suit over a minimum answer from partner who could be broke is 17/18 or so, at least, taking shape and suit quality / length into consideration.
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