[thepossum]

Dear all,

Please ignore IMP consideration of going down 1 versus an easy game. I nearly bid to slam despite light points and possible problems with K singleton and club/diamond losers. Could any bidding of cues and other bids etc. show that we had 9 trumps, singleton club opposite Ace, great hearts and only loser the K H.

I nearly went for it but thought we only had 8 trumps so didn't explore Blackwood or cues and bid 6. I considered 5C then North may have bid to slam

Regards Possum

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[HardVector]

You don't want to be in slam. You have one guaranteed loser in hearts and the diamond suit is likely to give you another. Assume, however, the opps make the wrong lead (say a club) and gives you time to knock out the A♥ to set up the suit. You still need guess the spades correctly to make 6. If you play the spades correctly, you are likely to get it right, but it's still a guess. If you get a diamond lead, you are down immediately.

[DozyDom]

Possum, you've avoided a terrible slam - that's a good thing. You can see that if a diamond is led, you'll have to lose the AH later, and then they can win a diamond.

Your hand evaluation is exactly right - you're light enough on points that without your partner having extras he hasn't shown, you aren't going to be able to make slam, even though there's only one loser off the top.

[pescetom]

You weren't as close to slam as you seem to think - you will make 5S thanks to trumps behaving. Your two hands don't have the combined strength for slam, even though they are both interesting. Cue bidding with first and second level controls you would have stopped in 5S, which turns out to be safe, but really there is no reason to do so. 4S is the right contract here.

[TylerE]

Splinter opp. a passed hand is a gross overbid IMO.

1♦-2♠-3♠-4♠ p. Easy game.

A minimum splinter would be more like ♠AKxx ♥x ♦KJTx ♣A9xx.

[akwoo]

I don't think this hand is worth a 3!H splinter - it's a 7 loser hand, albeit about the best possible 7 loser hand.

I wouldn't even jump raise playing K-S, though I do playing strong NT (or Precision).

[Cthulhu D]

Yeah, this is one of those times where you randomly get lucky and make 6... you don't want to count on getting a lucky in game vs slam (whereas you might want to aim to be a bit lucky in game vs part score).

[HardVector]

Oh, by the way, a good rule to use is that you are not allowed to add points for high cards and shortness in the same suit. So the heart suit is either worth 3 points for the K, or 3 points for the singleton, NOT 6 points for both. That may be why you may have been thinking slam, but your hand isn't that strong.

[thepossum]

HardVector, on 2018-October-29, 22:43, said:

Oh, by the way, a good rule to use is that you are not allowed to add points for high cards and shortness in the same suit. So the heart suit is either worth 3 points for the K, or 3 points for the singleton, NOT 6 points for both. That may be why you may have been thinking slam, but your hand isn't that strong.

Thanks everyone, yeah I discounted my K and had too many other weaknesses but I always think maybe sometimes I should try to explore more rather than jumping prematurely

[paulg]

Most inexperienced, and many experienced, players overbid (4441) hands. They are never really as good as they look at the time because of the slow losers outside your fit. A singleton honour is even worse as, mentally, you have already overvalued it.

[RD350LC]

paulg, on 2018-October-30, 02:19, said:

Most inexperienced, and many experienced, players overbid (4441) hands. They are never really as good as they look at the time because of the slow losers outside your fit. A singleton honour is even worse as, mentally, you have already overvalued it.

I agree completely. I would not have splintered in 3♥, but simply bid 2♠. The hand is worth at most 16 points, and I would consider it to be closer to the 15 hcp that you have. So a suggested auction would be:

1♦, 1♠; 2♠, 4♠. Enough said.

[aawk]

Giving a splinter with a singleton K is not recommended but that aside your partners bid should be 4♠ and not 4♦ due to his holdings in ♥.

If you play serious and non serious cue bids 4♦ is iffy but ok but if you do your bid of 4♠ is the right action.

[hamish32]

We play a structure that could get you to 6. Weather its good bridge to grt to 6 is another question:

We open 1NT with all 4441 shapes:

1NT - 2D
2H - 2H
2S - 2NT
3C - 3S
4C - 4D
4H - 4S
5S - 6S

2D = a transfer could be 4 when game forcing woth both majors
2H = no superaccecpt
2S = reveling the gf with majors
2NT = clarifying
3C = a 54 shape
3D = asking
3S = 5S 4H
4C = cue first or second a good hand for a potential S slam but not enough for 3NT serious.
4D = cue first or second ( you might sing off in 4S at this point given the natire of your game force, opener may still have another go with 4NT key card
4H = cue first or second
4S = 0-1 key cards turbo
5S = 3 or 5 key cards plus a contorl in S turbo
6S = well we have enough keys (again after cueing 4D you might pass here missing a key card but you do have the Q so its probably right to raise here.

[hamish32]

duplication

[hamish32]

You have noticed that all you need to do to defeat this slam is lead a D before the A of H is knocked out. The D could easily be KQ the Q of S could be Qxx many ways this it is likley wrong to play slam and even the lucky layout you might find an agressive lead of a small D.