[nige1]

MrAce, on 2017-May-02, 06:32, said:

1♦--1♥
2♠ is better way to start. Yes I know this shows a very decent 18 or 19+ but whoever thinks S hand is worth less than 19 needs some hand evaluation practice.

I was wrong -- 2♠ is a more descriptive rebid than 1♠. You are well worth it. Responder still has a hard choice.

[rmnka447]

The South hand is huge. 4 losers, 17 HCP, honors/intermediates in all suits and a void. The ♦ suit is solid and will play opposite a stiff (52% chance of 6 tricks [3-3 or doubleton J]). So, I think 1 ♦ followed by 2 ♠ is right.

The question then depends on your agreements for responder rebids over jump shifts/reverses. Using something simple like the cheaper of 2 NT/4th suit as possible start of a signoff, I think the possible rebids are 2 NT (deliberate underbid to let opener tell his story), 3 ♦, or 3 NT.

I think responder (North) has to realize that with ♦ Jxxx, a doubleton in opener's second suit, and controls in the other two suits, a ♦ slam is a distinct possibility. So for me, 3 NT is out. It does show about the right values but often makes it harder for opener to go on when it's right to do so. 2 NT is too much of an underbid. So, 3 ♦ seems right. It shows a positive hand, ♦ fit, and still has some possibilities of bidding NT later.

After a further 3 ♥ by opener suggesting at least 4=3=5=1, North could then bid 3 NT. That should suggest only 4 ♥ (else a 4 ♥ bid with 5+) and 3+ ♦. With a flat 3=4=3=3 hand or 2=4=3=4, responder might just bid 3 NT directly over 2 ♠ with stoppers. So 3 ♦ followed by 3 NT is a little more encouraging with regards to a ♦ contract.

4 ♦ by South is now a slam try and North should cooperate with a 4 ♥ cue. Then depending on your cueing methods/ace asks, you shouldn't have problems sorting out whether to bid slam.

[Stephen Tu]

Is 2S not gf really std assumed now by adv/expert? Have I finally aged enough to dinosaur status?

Is it best to have some sort of lebensohlish 2nt even if 2s is gf, so opener can avoid going past 3nt opposite the low end of responder's hands?

I guess this is all good in theory but most of my partners are a good 10 years older and more of a dinosaur than I am, probably hard to get them to go for more complexity for these rare auctions.

[Stephen Tu]

Dup post deleted

[P_Marlowe]

Stephen Tu, on 2017-May-02, 21:05, said:

Is 2S not gf really std assumed now by adv/expert? Have I finally aged enough to dinosaur status?

Is it best to have some sort of lebensohlish 2nt even if 2s is gf, so opener can avoid going past 3nt opposite the low end of responder's hands?

I guess this is all good in theory but most of my partners are a good 10 years older and more of a dinosaur than I am, probably hard to get them to go for more complexity for these rare auctions.

I did not scan to deeply the posts of the 2S bidders, but my feeling is, most imply, that 2S is gf.
I can see, that 2S showing reverse strength or better is a sensible treatment, espesially, if you
play 1S in the seq. as nf.

[rhm]

P_Marlowe, on 2017-May-02, 01:13, said:

Hi,

1D - 1H
1S (1) - 1NT
2C (2) - 3NT (3)
Pass (4) - ...

(1) you need to decide, if you want to force to game, most likely not
(2) FSF, what ever you want to call it, not GF
(3) max., club stopper, denies a 5th heart, stopper take precedence over
support for openers minor
(4) will make, we have 8 tricks, and partner needs only to stop clubs

With kind regards
Marlowe

Hi,

1♦ - 1♥
2♠(1) - 2NT
3♥ - 3NT (2)
Pass(3) - ...

(1) you need to decide, if you want to force to game, most likely yes. If you do not force to game here, when will you? This is a great hand after the 1♥ response.
The force helps finding the diamond slam, for example when responders honors in clubs and hearts would be the other way round. (In that case responder would not insist on notrumps but support diamonds)
(2) max club stopper, does not deny a 5th heart, also value duplication in clubs takes precedence over support for openers minor when holding no values in openers suits.
(3) you have shown your values and given a good description of your hand and partners club values is not really what you were looking for.

With kind regards
Rainer Herrmann

[ggwhiz]

Stephen Tu, on 2017-May-02, 21:05, said:

Is 2S not gf really std assumed now by adv/expert? Have I finally aged enough to dinosaur status?

Is it best to have some sort of lebensohlish 2nt even if 2s is gf, so opener can avoid going past 3nt opposite the low end of responder's hands?

I guess this is all good in theory but most of my partners are a good 10 years older and more of a dinosaur than I am, probably hard to get them to go for more complexity for these rare auctions.

The advantages are that you get to bid more and more often with less and that seems to be fashionable can be sold to a lot dinosaurs. Late in life Ozzie Jacoby started opening trashy 11's in 1st and said it was because he wasn't sure if he would still be there when the bidding got back to him.

1. You can stretch reverses to a lot of chucky 16's with good shape especially with 3 good pieces in partners response which may or may not be 4 cards. How frequent is a 2♠ game forcing jump anyway?

2. Using 2nt as lebensohl allows you to break the relay to 3♣ with a rock crusher and partner doesn't have to pass your (could be short?) 1♣ openers with shapely worms.

Don't sell the dinosaurs short.

A friend of mine played with one returning to the game after decades away and when they were filling out the card and he asked Negative Doubles? The guy said No. He put down his pen and asked him about his start in Bridge.

The guy said, I had a really good partner to start but he moved to San Fran. My next partner was great too but he left for Toronto. Peter Pender and Sammi Kehela.

Years later the last few times I played against this dinosaur he was playing Kamikazee notrump and Yee Haa.

[dave_beer]

Stephen Tu, on 2017-May-02, 01:32, said:

Is 1d-1h-1s-1nt-2c artificial without prior agreement or is it 4=0=5=4?

I play it as either 4=0=5=4 or 4=1=4=4 but denying showing extra values. Without prior agreement I would expect natural but with extras.

[dave_beer]

1♦-1♥
2♠ = I am willing to force to game after partner responds
.....-2NT = If I don't show stoppers now it may be hard to do so later
3♦ = I prefer this to 3♥ with such good ♦ and without high ♥ honor
.....-4♦
4♠ = Bidding 4♥ now would be control-showing
.....- Have to decide between signing off in 4NT or bidding 6♦

[Winstonm]

1D-1H
2S-4D
4S-4N
6C-6D