[Stephen Tu]

Quote

I guess you made a claim you could hardly defend. At least, in the old days,
to bid twice is stronger than bid once, especially when one bids a new suit,
it almost always shows further interest rather than none.

Go to the library. Find any Goren book circa 1940 something. Look up this sequence. New suits at the 2 level by responder, after opener's 1nt rebid, were *non-forcing*, not encouraging.

It is the forcing new minor / checkback stayman / 2-way checkback treatments that are "new". Simple new minor suit bids after 1nt used to be non-forcing also. If you wanted to force you had to jump.

New suits have been forcing, and encouraging, after opener's *non-1nt* rebids. In the very old days, like 1920s, even this wasn't forcing. My friend has a collection of very old Bridge Worlds, it is astounding how many bids were non-forcing. One had to jump-shift to create a force.

[arrows]

of course it's NOT forcing.

[Stephen Tu]

Nor is it invitational, forward going, encouraging, etc. Opener shouldn't raise without an exceptionally great hand (e.g. 4 cd support, double fit, honors packed in the majors). He is expected to pass or take a 2S preference 95% of the time.

Your contention is that responder can't have an invitational hand in hearts after a nmf/checkback sequence, since he would bid 2H with that. There is no modern convention reference book that will support your contention. Look it up. Root/Pavlicek, Robinson, Lawrence, Hardy, Kearse, Jannersten - none of these books will support you.
People bid nmf with invitational hands 5/4 in the majors, all the time. So it is not unreasonable to choose a response style that bids the other major first. Immediate 2H bid over 1nt is always described as non-invitational.

[pork rind]

thanx all for the replies. definitely gives me food for thought.
this was the second time i had played with this partner. i think in a pickup game the way many of us play in bbo, preference should be given to showing the 3 card support. i dont mind his 1nt bid, and even thought the 2h bid is helpful, 2s is more helpful. in a regular partnership, this can be discussed.
anyhow, i thank you all for your replies.

[arrows]

Quote

Nor is it invitational, forward going, encouraging, etc. Opener shouldn't raise without an exceptionally great hand (e.g. 4 cd support, double fit, honors packed in the majors). He is expected to pass or take a 2S preference 95% of the time.

Your contention is that responder can't have an invitational hand in hearts after a nmf/checkback sequence, since he would bid 2H with that. There is no modern convention reference book that will support your contention. Look it up. Root/Pavlicek, Robinson, Lawrence, Hardy, Kearse, Jannersten - none of these books will support you.
People bid nmf with invitational hands 5/4 in the majors, all the time. So it is not unreasonable to choose a response style that bids the other major first. Immediate 2H bid over 1nt is always described as non-invitational.

I am bored to keep arguing over this. How about we follow a link given
by yourself...

Quote

There's an outline of a well structured weak NT system, K-S,here.

Go to the section B-6, see what you can find there.

[the hog]

1m : 1♠ : 1nt : 2♥

This should of course be a transfer to S. Transfer checkback is far more effective than nmf or 2 way checkback.

[Stephen Tu]

Quote

I am bored to keep arguing over this. How about we follow a link given
by yourself...

K-S is not the same as Standard American. The treatment in KS updated is non-standard.

Again, I challenge you to name any book on standard american claiming your sequence as invitational ...

If you want some web references try
http://www.rpbridge.net/7g19.htm#16
"2H new suit - no game interest; NF"

If you want my book references I can find some page numbers in at least 3 books over the weekend.

Also, check out the "learn to play bridge" reference on Bridge base online. Let me quote:
"Good news!!! When opener rebids 1NT, responder's rebid in a new lower-ranking suit is a non-forcing bid, suggesting a minimum hand that is unsuitable for notrump play ... This is the one situation where a new suit by responder is not forcing. This rebid suggests an unbalanced hand with less than 11 total points".

This is from the "more on bidding", "responder's maximum rebids" section.