[dickiegera]

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I felt I needed 18-19 pts to bid 2NT so I passed.

West bid 3♣, South bid 3♠ which went down 3.

How do we get to 3NT.
What would a double by West instead of 3♣ mean

Comments please

[SteveMoe]

1♣-(P) - 1♦ - (2♠)
PASS - (P) - DOUBLE - (P)
2NT - (P) - 3NT - All Pass

Pass shows a min bal/wk NT.
Double is takeout, implying short ♠s, ♦ length and 3 cards+ in the other 2 suits.
2N shows ♠ stop and a minimum bal hand.

I like DOUBLE more than 2♠ as East might have a penalty pass.

3♣ is invitational - with 12 opposite 12 (and a potential source of tricks) 3N should be in the picture.

[akwoo]

Pass by east is certainly right there.

I think a double by west should show 4 hearts almost all the time, although I can see why one might double with this West hand.

As West, I would bid 3♠, asking for a spade stopper for 3N. I admit that partner might have a weak-ish stopper, no diamond cards, and no club length, in which case we go down. But the pre-empt means we only have the room to distinguish between 2 levels of strength - enough to compete/sacrifice at the 3 level, and game-forcing; we don't have room left to invite. (Perhaps someone will suggest some version of Lebenshol here to take care of this problem?)

I would not take 3♣ to be invitational; my default rules (all raises in competition are preemptive/competitive unless bidder's length in the suit is limited) consider that bid is merely competitive (but I'm willing to consider an argument that my default rules are wrong - or bidder's length is limited - in this case).

[TWO4BRIDGE]

2NT ( A J x is the "Bath Coupe" holding = you duck South's lead of the K and he has to switch )
East
1C - ( p ) - 1D - ( 2S )
2NT - ( p ) - 3NT - all pass

[kenberg]

Whether X shows four hearts depends on what sor tof hann starts off responding 1♦ to 1♣. If W would always bid his hearts in preference to diamonds unless he has opening hand strength, then X is not needed to show four hearts, he would simply bid 3♥ showing a strong and shapely hand. But if W would bid 1♦ holding, say, five diamonds, four hearts and ten points then yes, I think that X should show four hearts.

If I, as W, can double w/o showing four hearts that's my choice. If partner bids NT I raise, if he bids 3♣ I am going to rebid my diamonds since I have six of them and, since I forced partner to bid I should not put too much weight on his 3♣ call. On this hand of course we easily get to 3NT over the X.

I suppose that it is possible partner will pass my X for penalties but not often I would think. If East's club deauc is changed to a spade deuce he might well do it, and I guess it will work out.

If X shows four hearts then I start with 3♠. It uses up a level of bidding, which could cost in later clarity, but I can't help that.