[Hanoi5]

♠65
♥AQ652
♦9
♣A9532


Would you open? Using the 'rule of 20' it's normal to open this kind of hands, but is there any way to 'show' it during the bidding?

Let's say it goes:

1♥ - 1♠
???

Would you bid 2♣ or 2♥? If you bid 2♣ how do you handle it after 4st suit forcing? Would you ever repeat your hearts to show a minimum hand? When? Would you just bid the hand normally and expect partner to understand you opened on 10 hcp?

[awm]

As a general rule you just take normal actions with a minimum hand. Partner is supposed to understand that you can be a bit light with a lot of shape. The theory is that this hand is worth about the same as a flat twelve-count if you have some semblance of a fit (which you usually do).

On this hand, you rebid 2♣ over 1♠ or 1NT response. You rebid 2♥ over a 2♦ response because 1♥-2♦-3♣ shows extra values (a 5-5 13-count might qualify, but I don't think a 5-5 ten-count does).

Note that the main reason to open these hands is to show both your suits, and find a good game if you have a fit (or compete in the auction). Opening 1♥ and rebidding 2♥ is silly -- you may as well have just opened 2♥ in the first place!

Personally, I would not open this particular hand. I tend to be more pessimistic than most in evaluating these sorts of hands (although some nice tens and nines in my suits could easily convince me to open).

[JLOL]

Wow @ not opening. Anyways as awm said just bid out your shape after opening.

[neilkaz]

JLOL, on Feb 4 2009, 03:39 PM, said:

Wow @ not opening. Anyways as awm said just bid out your shape after opening.

Agreed and I'd honestly open this hand playing with most PD's if my 2 of ♣ were a ♠.

[skjaeran]

Obvious opening to me. Easy 2♣ rebid, show 9 of my cards.

[Lobowolf]

Additionally in support of opening this hand, it has 2 1/2 quick tricks; if partner doubles based on the premise that you have an opening bid, this hand won't disappoint.

[Lobowolf]

JLOL, on Feb 4 2009, 04:39 PM, said:

Wow @ not opening. Anyways as awm said just bid out your shape after opening.

Adam has JUICE around here. He got a "Wow" instead of an "LOL."

[JLOL]

Well I'm with him in spirit that people open too light based on shape (many threads on this discussion), I just think its going too far with AQ A in your suits... the point remains that you might get too high opposite a misfitting 13 or whatever that game forces but I think passing this hand just takes it too far. Anyways not really LOL just style and judgement.

[the hog]

I can't imagine anyone not opening this hand - well that is not quite true as Adam didn't open it.
To me and to all I know this is an obvious one level opening. If you are playing some sort of 2 suited opening bid and are vul, I might try that, but it would be too good for a non vul 2 suited opening.

[neilkaz]

Lobowolf, on Feb 4 2009, 06:21 PM, said:

Additionally in support of opening this hand, it has 2 1/2 quick tricks; if partner doubles based on the premise that you have an opening bid, this hand won't disappoint.

Another point about opening is that you'd like a ♥ lead much of the time.

[655321]

Like most people, I would open this hand and feel happy about it.

But I understand you to be asking, 'How do you tell partner that even though you have opened the bidding, you don't have an opening hand?'

Well, you can't. Having partly described your hand ('worth opening the bidding') your further bids will narrow down your range for partner (perhaps 'minimum with hearts and clubs'), but further bids won't cancel what you have already shown.

Anyway, you open the bidding when you judge that you have a hand where that is the right thing to do, not when some rule tells you to. If you want to pass instead then pass.

[mikeh]

I am, by comparison to many of the posters here, a conservative opening bidder but passing this is too much (well, technically... too little)

I don't use the rule of 20. It is far too simplistic and prone to abuse.

[ASkolnick]

We tend to use the rule of 22 (Which is the rule of 20 plus quick tricks). Seems reasonable to evaluate that way, but the problem is When you don't have a fit, you tend to go down.

Not saying I wouldn't open this, but everyone always says shape is good.
The problem is shape is only good provided you have a fit.

[helene_t]

Hanoi5, on Feb 4 2009, 06:32 PM, said:

1♥ - 1♠
???

2♣ obviously, it doesn't promise more that 2♥ does (if you play sounds preempts and don't play Muiderberg or some such, in fact 2♥ would promise more as a one-suiter with similar playing strength would have preempted).

[Phil]

ASkolnick, on Feb 5 2009, 11:02 AM, said:

We tend to use the rule of 22 (Which is the rule of 20 plus quick tricks).

And you have 2 1/2 QT's.

Obvious opening bid.