[sceptic]

Scoring: IMP

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West North East South

 -     -     1♣    Pass
 1♦    Pass  2♣    Pass
 2♥    Pass  2NT   Pass
 3NT   Pass  Pass  Pass
 

[jtfanclub]

I would just bid 3NT over 2♣, but I don't understand the question. All roads lead to 3NT, it's just whether you want to take the scenic route to get there.

[jillybean]

I dont like the reverse on 4/4, why not 1♥ ; 3nt

[ArcLight]

jillybean2, on Jul 27 2008, 01:36 PM, said:

I dont like the reverse on 4/4, why not 1♥ ; 3nt

For those who bypass ♦ to show a major, there is an exception. Bid big hands traditionally. That is, Dimes before Hearts with 4/4.

Thats why 1D is the correct first bid and not 1H

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

if you bid 1D or 1H is a matter of style,
but bidding 2H over 2C is pointless,
partner has limited itself and denied 4
hearts, hence bidding 2H over 2C makes
no real sense, ... you also have stoppers
in all suits.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[cherdano]

There is no "correct" choice between 1D and 1H, just a matter of partnership agreement. I would just bid 3N over 2♣ also.

[ArcLight]

cherdano, on Jul 27 2008, 03:13 PM, said:

There is no "correct" choice between 1D and 1H, just a matter of partnership agreement. I would just bid 3N over 2♣ also.

I don't agree, assuming you are playing Walsh.
With this good a hand you bid 1D.
Same for tradistional.

[cherdano]

ArcLight, on Jul 27 2008, 02:18 PM, said:

cherdano, on Jul 27 2008, 03:13 PM, said:

There is no "correct" choice between 1D and 1H, just a matter of partnership agreement. I would just bid 3N over 2♣ also.

I don't agree, assuming you are playing Walsh.
With this good a hand you bid 1D.
Same for tradistional.

Some partnerships agree that you never bid 1♦ with 4D and 4M.

This auction is a good example why this style can be useful, btw. 1♦ then 2♥ over 2♣ promises an unbalanced hand, and with the actual hand you can find out about a spade stopper with 1H, then 2D without implyin an unbalanced hand.

[mike777]

ArcLight, on Jul 27 2008, 03:18 PM, said:

cherdano, on Jul 27 2008, 03:13 PM, said:

There is no "correct" choice between 1D and 1H, just a matter of partnership agreement. I would just bid 3N over 2♣ also.

I don't agree, assuming you are playing Walsh.
With this good a hand you bid 1D.
Same for tradistional.

Many still bypass 1d and bid 1h with this hand.

Bidding 1d and then 2h, even playing Walsh may promise 5D and 4H.

Yes that means you may miss a diamond fit but then many with 5c and 4d or 4-4 in minors start out with one D...........matter of style.

Playing Walsh these "d suit" issues are common and most just choose to live with it.


1c=1h=2c=3nt=p.

[andy_h]

agree that there is no correct choice but it's on agreement.

[ochinko]

I like to always bypass the diamonds, no matter how long they are, and no matter how strong my hand is. That way the 4th suit is never real, just a way to show extras and push partner to further describe her hand.

So just like Jillybean I'll go 1♥, 3NT. It's harder for opps to defend against a declarer who's hand contains 4 spades and 6 diamonds with equal probability.

[helene_t]

Whether you show your diamonds or not depend on how often p would open 1♣ holding four diamonds, and whether you really care about the diamond fit. If you want to bid both suits, obviously you must start with diamonds since you don't want to pretend to have five hearts. Lying about the diamonds is less of a problem.

I can sorta understand 2♥ over 2♣ as 3NT may play better in opener's hand but you do promise five diamonds now. 3NT over 2♣ is the orthodox bid, I suppose.

[y66]

The agreements in Bridge World Standard 2001 are:

After a one-club opening*, responder normally bids one diamond with longer diamonds than either major, or with four-four in diamonds and a major in a hand worth at least a game invitation; but the normal response is in a four-card major with a minimum-range response and four-four in a major and diamonds.

In the poll that was used as a basis for these agreements:

41 percent of experts bypass 1D when they hold 4 diamonds, 4 hearts and game invitational or better values;

27 percent of experts bypass 1D when they hold 4 diamonds, 4 spades and game invitational or better values; and

10 percent of experts bypass 1D when they hold 5 diamonds and 4 of either major and game invitational or better values.

More players bypass with hearts because LHO is more likely to overcall 1S making it harder to find the heart fit.

Personally, I like bidding 1D here. Agree with others that this is a per partnership decision.

* In BWS 2001 the agreements for 1C and 1D openings are: with three-three in the minors, always bid one club; with either four-four in the minors or four diamonds, five clubs and a minimum-range hand, use judgment to decide which minor to open.

[ArtK78]

Unless I am missing something, there is more to this hand than whether it is right to bid hearts before diamonds or vice versa.

At IMPs, it is a very close call whether 3NT or 5♣ is the better contract.

If you bring in the club suit for 6 tricks (one loser), both 5♣ and 3NT will make. 3NT may make 630 or 660 as opposed to the 600 that you get in 5♣.

On the other hand, on a normal heart lead, if you cannot bring in the club suit for 6 tricks, both 3NT and 5♣ will go down. 5♣ is not likely to go down more than one trick (two only if clubs are 4-0 offside). 3NT, on the other hand, will almost always go down more than one trick if the club suit does not come in.

Properly played, both contracts have the same chances of making.

So, the issue is whether it is right to play in notrump, which will score an extra 30 or 60 points most times when both contracts make, or whether it is right to play in 5♣, which almost always goes down fewer tricks than 3NT when both contracts fail.

There is one additional factor. If clubs are 4-0 offside, it is possible that 5♣ could get doubled.